They tried to execute her twice. She survived. | Man faces trial 14 years after student’s slaying

Welcome to the Welcome to the sidebar from True Crime News, sidebar from True Crime News, sidebar from True Crime News, which invites you into the which invites you into the which invites you into the courtrooms of high-profile and courtrooms of high-profile and courtrooms of high-profile and infamous cases from infamous cases from infamous cases from across the country. I'm your across the country. I'm your across the country. I'm your host, Joshua host, Joshua host, Joshua Ritter. I am a criminal defense attorney Ritter. I am a criminal defense attorney practicing in Los Angeles, and previously Angeles, and previously served as the served as the Los Angeles County District Attorney for over ten years. Los Angeles County District Attorney for over ten years. Los Angeles County District Attorney for over ten years. We record this on We record this on We record this on Thursday, October 8, Thursday, October 8, Thursday, October 8, 2026. In this 2026. In this 2026. In this week's episode, a week's episode, a week's episode, a man stands man stands man stands trial for the murder and trial for the murder and trial for the murder and assault of a assault of a assault of a University of University of University of North Carolina student North Carolina student North Carolina student 14 years after 14 years after 14 years after her death. Additionally, her death. Additionally, her death. Additionally, prosecutors are dropping prosecutors are dropping prosecutors are dropping additional additional additional charges against a charges against a charges against a man man man accused of accused of accused of perpetrating a deadly perpetrating a deadly custody battle in Florida. custody battle in Florida. But first, But first, But first, how Krista Pike survived how Krista Pike survived how Krista Pike survived lethal lethal lethal injection while injection while injection while the country struggles with the country struggles with state-sanctioned state-sanctioned death penalty procedures. death penalty procedures. Joining us today is Dave Joining us today is Dave Aronberg, attorney, Aronberg, attorney, Aronberg, attorney, former former former state senator, and host of the state senator, and host of the state senator, and host of the YouTube channel Florida Law Man. YouTube channel Florida Law Man. YouTube channel Florida Law Man. Dave, welcome back, Dave, welcome back, Dave, welcome back, buddy. How are you doing? buddy. How are you doing? buddy. How are you doing? Oh, it's great to be with Oh, it's great to be with Oh, it's great to be with you again, Josh. Thank you you again, Josh. Thank you you again, Josh. Thank you for inviting me. for inviting me. for inviting me. Of course. I'm looking forward to Of course. I'm looking forward to this because I know this because I know you have a lot of experience as a you have a lot of experience as a you have a lot of experience as a prosecutor, and prosecutor, and prosecutor, and some of these cases some of these cases some of these cases will require some will require some will require some expertise. So, expertise. So, expertise. So, let's let's let's jump right to jump right to jump right to Davidson County, Davidson County, Davidson County, Tennessee, where a Tennessee, where a death row inmate death row inmate regained consciousness regained consciousness regained consciousness earlier this week earlier this week earlier this week after two failed after two failed after two failed execution attempts. Christa execution attempts. Christa execution attempts. Christa Pike was set to become the Pike was set to become the Pike was set to become the first woman first woman first woman executed in the state in executed in the state in executed in the state in more than 200 years, but the more than 200 years, but the more than 200 years, but the planned planned planned lethal injection lethal injection lethal injection ran into ran into ran into difficulties, and then difficulties, and then difficulties, and then another. After another. After another. After receiving two doses of receiving two doses of receiving two doses of pentobarbital, Pike was pentobarbital, Pike was pentobarbital, Pike was still breathing and still breathing and still breathing and making choking making choking making choking sounds as officials sounds as officials sounds as officials tried to tried to tried to determine determine determine next steps.

next steps. next steps. While the state allows a While the state allows a While the state allows a second dose of second dose of second dose of intravenous intravenous intravenous medication if medication if medication if the first is unsuccessful, there is no the first is unsuccessful, there is no the first is unsuccessful, there is no set set set protocol for protocol for protocol for what to do if that what to do if that what to do if that also fails. also fails. also fails. Eventually, Pike Eventually, Pike Eventually, Pike was rushed was rushed was rushed to the hospital, where she was to the hospital, where she was to the hospital, where she was intubated for over intubated for over intubated for over a week before a week before a week before she regained consciousness. she regained consciousness. Pike is now reportedly Pike is now reportedly suffering from suffering from suffering from pneumonia and pneumonia and pneumonia and has lost the has lost the has lost the use of her hands use of her hands as authorities as authorities as authorities decide whether decide whether decide whether she will she will she will face the face the face the death penalty again for the brutal death penalty again for the brutal 1995 murder of Colleen Slemmer. The botched execution botched execution drew drew drew national attention to national attention to national attention to the practice of executions, which is the practice of executions, which is the practice of executions, which is shrouded in secrecy, and shrouded in secrecy, and shrouded in secrecy, and a judge ordered a judge ordered a judge ordered all evidence of all evidence of all evidence of the attempt preserved for the attempt preserved for the attempt preserved for legal legal legal investigation. Dave, investigation. Dave, investigation. Dave, this whole thing is a mess this whole thing is a mess , but I want to start by saying , but I want to start by saying , but I want to start by saying that I don't want the that I don't want the that I don't want the murder of murder of murder of Colleen Slemmer to be forgotten here. It Colleen Slemmer to be forgotten here. It Colleen Slemmer to be forgotten here. It was brutal, it was brutal, it was brutal, it was horrific, she was was horrific, she was was horrific, she was tortured, a pentagram tortured, a pentagram tortured, a pentagram was carved into her chest was carved into her chest was carved into her chest , and then , and then , and then Pike carried a Pike carried a Pike carried a piece of her skull with her for piece of her skull with her for piece of her skull with her for days before days before days before she was eventually she was eventually she was eventually arrested. So this arrested. So this arrested. So this was a murder that was a murder that was a murder that certainly certainly certainly deserved the deserved the deserved the death penalty. But death penalty. But death penalty. But now we find ourselves in a now we find ourselves in a now we find ourselves in a situation where everything has situation where everything has situation where everything has been completely been completely been completely ruined after ruined after ruined after Pike's lawyers Pike's lawyers Pike's lawyers warned the authorities that warned the authorities that warned the authorities that they would face they would face they would face these problems. So these problems. So these problems. So now, in this situation, now, in this situation, now, in this situation, when you've when you've when you've been told everything, we been told everything, we been told everything, we find ourselves in this find ourselves in this find ourselves in this position. My position. My position. My question to you is: question to you is: question to you is: can they can they can they seek the death seek the death seek the death penalty again? Should they penalty again? Should they penalty again? Should they do this? Is this do this? Is this do this? Is this perhaps a turning perhaps a turning perhaps a turning point in our

point in our point in our perception of this, ahem, perception of this, ahem, perception of this, ahem, greatest greatest greatest punishment in our punishment in our punishment in our country? country? country? Well, I think the Well, I think the Well, I think the answer is–yes, they answer is–yes, they answer is–yes, they can. This is not can. This is not can. This is not necessarily a necessarily a necessarily a violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth Amendment against Amendment against Amendment against cruel and cruel and cruel and unusual unusual unusual punishment. Hmm, I know, punishment. Hmm, I know, punishment. Hmm, I know, it just looks it just looks it just looks awful. I awful. I awful. I mean mean mean the incompetence of the the incompetence of the the incompetence of the Tennessee government. This is not the Tennessee government. This is not the Tennessee government. This is not the first time first time first time this has happened. this has happened. this has happened. There was the There was the There was the Caruthers case where they Caruthers case where they Caruthers case where they apparently couldn't apparently couldn't apparently couldn't find the, uh, vein. They find the, uh, vein. They find the, uh, vein. They kept poking kept poking kept poking them everywhere, and it's even them everywhere, and it's even them everywhere, and it's even worse because here worse because here worse because here they actually they actually they actually delivered the medicine, and delivered the medicine, and delivered the medicine, and she survived. And so she survived. And so she survived. And so they can't, meaning they can't, meaning they can't, meaning they'll ruin they'll ruin they'll ruin the funeral in two the funeral in two the funeral in two cars, it seems like these cars, it seems like these cars, it seems like these people. And because of that, I would people. And because of that, I would people. And because of that, I would say, uh, the moratorium is say, uh, the moratorium is say, uh, the moratorium is right, and they right, and they right, and they should consider should consider should consider taking her off taking her off taking her off death row and death row and death row and just giving her just giving her just giving her life in prison life in prison life in prison because of because of Tennessee's incompetence. But, Tennessee's incompetence. But, regardless of regardless of regardless of whether it's constitutional whether it's constitutional whether it's constitutional to continue, I to continue, I to continue, I believe it's believe it's believe it's constitutional, and this constitutional, and this constitutional, and this very conservative very conservative very conservative Supreme Court, with a Supreme Court, with a Supreme Court, with a conservative conservative conservative 6-3 majority, I believe 6-3 majority, I believe , will uphold it as not , will uphold it as not , will uphold it as not violating the Eighth violating the Eighth violating the Eighth Amendment against Amendment against Amendment against cruel and cruel and cruel and unusual unusual unusual punishment. So punishment. So punishment. So the question for me is not the question for me is not the question for me is not whether it's whether it's whether it's constitutional, but constitutional, but constitutional, but whether the whether the whether the governor actually wants governor actually wants governor actually wants to continue this to continue this to continue this even after the even after the even after the moratorium ends moratorium ends .

. . I think you are absolutely I think you are absolutely I think you are absolutely right. I think right. I think right. I think it's going to become it's going to become it's going to become much more of a much more of a much more of a political issue at this point. political issue at this point. political issue at this point. If they put If they put If they put the issue of clemency before him the issue of clemency before him the issue of clemency before him , well, I don't , well, I don't , well, I don't know if it's a know if it's a know if it's a clemency or if it's just going to be clemency or if it's just going to be clemency or if it's just going to be seen as a seen as a seen as a reduction of her reduction of her reduction of her sentence, whatever sentence, whatever sentence, whatever powers he powers he powers he has, uh, to make it so that has, uh, to make it so that has, uh, to make it so that she just she just she just gets gets gets life without parole instead of the life without parole instead of the death penalty. I think the death penalty. I think the governor governor governor will take this will take this will take this opportunity to opportunity to opportunity to just walk away from just walk away from just walk away from this absolute this absolute this absolute disaster that disaster that disaster that this whole thing is. But this whole thing is. But this whole thing is. But I'm curious what I'm curious what I'm curious what you think the implications of this might be at the you think the implications of this might be at the you think the implications of this might be at the national level national level . I'm curious that you're in . I'm curious that you're in Florida. Mr. Florida. Mr. Florida. Mr. Florida lawyer, Florida has Florida lawyer, Florida has Florida lawyer, Florida has no problem with no problem with no problem with capital punishment. I didn't capital punishment. I didn't capital punishment. I didn't realize it, but realize it, but realize it, but last year they last year they last year they executed 19 people, and executed 19 people, and executed 19 people, and this this this year they are expected year they are expected year they are expected to reach a similar number. to reach a similar number. to reach a similar number. So, certainly, some So, certainly, some So, certainly, some states agree with the idea of states agree with the idea of states agree with the idea of capital punishment. I am in California. For capital punishment. I am in California. For capital punishment. I am in California. For years, the governor years, the governor years, the governor imposed a moratorium on this imposed a moratorium on this imposed a moratorium on this . Do . Do . Do you think that with you think that with you think that with our current our current our current attitude towards the attitude towards the attitude towards the death penalty, a death penalty, a death penalty, a disaster like this could disaster like this could disaster like this could change change change people's perception of it, and we could people's perception of it, and we could people's perception of it, and we could see it being see it being see it being used even used even used even less and less in more and more less and less in more and more states?

You know, this will widen the You know, this will widen the gap between states gap between states gap between states that implement it that implement it that implement it and states that don't. and states that don't. and states that don't. We already have a few We already have a few We already have a few states that states that states that use it, like use it, like use it, like Florida, which Florida, which Florida, which uses it uses it uses it more often than more often than more often than most. And other most. And other most. And other states have a states have a states have a moratorium on it, moratorium on it, moratorium on it, you know, like you know, like you know, like California, where it's in California, where it's in California, where it's in the law, but it's the law, but it's the law, but it's not actually not actually not actually enforced. There is a enforced. There is a enforced. There is a moratorium there. Uh, I moratorium there. Uh, I moratorium there. Uh, I think this case will think this case will think this case will reignite the debate, but reignite the debate, but reignite the debate, but as far as changing as far as changing as far as changing minds in states like minds in states like minds in states like Florida where it Florida where it Florida where it applies, no, I don't think that's going applies, no, I don't think that's going applies, no, I don't think that's going to happen. to happen. In fact, In fact, we had a botched we had a botched we had a botched execution in Florida where we execution in Florida where we execution in Florida where we used the used the used the electric chair, electric chair, electric chair, and smoke started coming out of the eyes of one of the people who were going to be and smoke started coming out of the eyes of one of the people who were going to be executed executed executed . And it . And it . And it really looked like a really looked like a really looked like a violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth Amendment, which prohibits Amendment, which prohibits Amendment, which prohibits cruel and cruel and cruel and unusual punishment unusual punishment , when the electric , when the electric , when the electric chair chair chair malfunctioned. And so Florida malfunctioned. And so Florida malfunctioned. And so Florida switched to a cocktail of switched to a cocktail of switched to a cocktail of drugs, similar drugs, similar drugs, similar to Tennessee, where it's to Tennessee, where it's to Tennessee, where it's allowed by the Eighth allowed by the Eighth allowed by the Eighth Amendment, and that's exactly what Amendment, and that's exactly what Amendment, and that's exactly what happened. By the way, happened. By the way, happened. By the way, you still have a choice.

you still have a choice. you still have a choice. If you want the If you want the If you want the electric chair, electric chair, electric chair, you can you can you can get it, but get it, but get it, but no one chose that. They... no one chose that. They... They all want They all want They all want lethal injection. lethal injection. lethal injection. That's why, That's why, That's why, going back to going back to going back to your first your first your first question, I don't think the question, I don't think the question, I don't think the re- re- re- execution of her, Pike execution of her, Pike , in Tennessee is a , in Tennessee is a , in Tennessee is a violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth Amendment, because it's a Amendment, because it's a Amendment, because it's a drug cocktail drug cocktail drug cocktail that's supported in that's supported in that's supported in all these other states all these other states all these other states and by the U.S. Supreme Court and by the U.S. Supreme Court . If that was the case, then it was . If that was the case, then it was . If that was the case, then it was messed up again, messed up again, messed up again, you could say, but you could say, but you could say, but that's happened in that's happened in that's happened in the past, okay? the past, okay? the past, okay? So, killing her So, killing her So, killing her when she's when she's when she's suffocating and doing suffocating and doing suffocating and doing all these things could be a all these things could be a all these things could be a violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth violation of the Eighth Amendment. But Amendment. But Amendment. But killing her again killing her again killing her again with an updated with an updated with an updated cocktail that cocktail that cocktail that works, in my opinion, works, in my opinion, works, in my opinion, is not a violation of the is not a violation of the is not a violation of the Eighth Amendment. Eighth Amendment. Eighth Amendment. Yes, I think you are Yes, I think you are Yes, I think you are absolutely right. And by absolutely right. And by absolutely right. And by the way, this in no way the way, this in no way the way, this in no way affects affects affects the legality of the the legality of the the legality of the actual sentence. I actual sentence. I actual sentence. I mean, there's mean, there's mean, there's nothing about this that nothing about this that nothing about this that they they they can go back on and can go back on and can go back on and say, "Well, maybe say, "Well, maybe say, "Well, maybe she shouldn't have been she shouldn't have been she shouldn't have been sentenced to sentenced to sentenced to death at all." death at all." It is clear that the verdict It is clear that the verdict given by a jury given by a jury given by a jury in Tennessee and the sentence in Tennessee and the sentence in Tennessee and the sentence given by a judge are given by a judge are given by a judge are independent of this. It's independent of this. It's just that the actual just that the actual execution execution execution was such an was such an was such an absolute, uh, absolute, uh, absolute, uh, disaster. So disaster. So disaster. So we'll see what they we'll see what they we'll see what they decide to do. I decide to do. I decide to do. I tend to agree tend to agree tend to agree with you. I think with you. I think with you. I think if you're in if you're in if you're in Tennessee, you Tennessee, you Tennessee, you want to put this want to put this want to put this ugly chapter ugly chapter ugly chapter behind you, uh, at least behind you, uh, at least behind you, uh, at least in this case, uh, and in this case, uh, and in this case, uh, and hope that people hope that people hope that people quickly forget about quickly forget about quickly forget about it and you can it and you can it and you can move on and move on and move on and fade from the spotlight.

fade from the spotlight. fade from the spotlight. Well, well, you see Well, well, you see gubernatorial candidate Marsha gubernatorial candidate Marsha Blackburn, who wants Blackburn, who wants Blackburn, who wants to be governor, and to be governor, and to be governor, and she says, “Let’s she says, “Let’s she says, “Let’s step on the gas. " step on the gas. " step on the gas. " Let's do it again. Let's do it again. Let's do it again. " So, you know, " So, you know, " So, you know, you have this very you have this very you have this very conservative state of conservative state of conservative state of Tennessee, where the Tennessee, where the Tennessee, where the legislature legislature legislature and the governor's office are and the governor's office are dominated by dominated by Republicans, and they're Republicans, and they're Republicans, and they're going to going to going to turn this into, I turn this into, I turn this into, I think, a partisan think, a partisan think, a partisan issue, where it's issue, where it's issue, where it's like, "No, no, we're for like, "No, no, we're for like, "No, no, we're for law and order, and this law and order, and this law and order, and this woman did woman did woman did terrible things, so terrible things, so terrible things, so let's, uh, execute let's, uh, execute let's, uh, execute her." As someone who her." As someone who her." As someone who has supported the death has supported the death has supported the death penalty here in Florida, I penalty here in Florida, I penalty here in Florida, I would say this: I would would say this: I would would say this: I would look at what the look at what the look at what the victim's family wants. We have victim's family wants. We have victim's family wants. We have n't heard yet what exactly they n't heard yet what exactly they n't heard yet what exactly they want to do next. want to do next. want to do next. If they say, " If they say, " We won't rest We won't rest We won't rest until she gets the until she gets the until she gets the death penalty," I death penalty," I death penalty," I think you should think you should think you should move on. If move on. If move on. If they say they're they say they're ambivalent about it, I do n't think you should n't think you should n't think you should do it. do it. do it. Great idea, yes. And Great idea, yes. And Great idea, yes. And we haven't heard back from them yet we haven't heard back from them yet we haven't heard back from them yet . So, uh, there's still a . So, uh, there's still a . So, uh, there's still a lot to be lot to be lot to be decided. They decided. They decided. They are conducting a full are conducting a full are conducting a full investigation to investigation to investigation to find out what went find out what went find out what went wrong, and we wrong, and we wrong, and we will continue will continue will continue to follow this to follow this to follow this story. story. story. Fast forward to Fast forward to Fast forward to Durham County, Durham County, Durham County, North Carolina, where North Carolina, where North Carolina, where 14 years after the 14 years after the 14 years after the murder and assault of murder and assault of murder and assault of Faith Hedgepeth, her Faith Hedgepeth, her Faith Hedgepeth, her accused accused accused murderer stands murderer stands murderer stands trial for her trial for her trial for her death. Prosecutors death. Prosecutors death. Prosecutors allege that allege that allege that Miguel Angel Miguel Angel Miguel Angel Sagerro Olivares Sagerro Olivares Sagerro Olivares fatally beat a fatally beat a University of North Carolina student with an University of North Carolina student with an empty empty empty Bacardi bottle after Bacardi bottle after Bacardi bottle after sexually sexually sexually assaulting assaulting assaulting the woman. The state's case the woman. The state's case the woman. The state's case is built on is built on is built on DNA evidence collected DNA evidence collected DNA evidence collected at the scene that at the scene that at the scene that allegedly links allegedly links allegedly links Olivares to a Olivares to a Olivares to a 2021 arrest for 2021 arrest for drunk driving.

drunk driving. Authorities claim Authorities claim Authorities claim his DNA matched his DNA matched his DNA matched DNA collected from the DNA collected from the DNA collected from the murder weapon, murder weapon, murder weapon, samples from the apartment, samples from the apartment, samples from the apartment, and locations all too and locations all too and locations all too blatantly mentioned blatantly mentioned blatantly mentioned in this program. Although in this program. Although in this program. Although there was some there was some there was some conspiracy conspiracy conspiracy speculation or, quote, speculation or, quote, speculation or, quote, hype in the case, the defense was hype in the case, the defense was hype in the case, the defense was prohibited from prohibited from prohibited from accusing anyone accusing anyone accusing anyone else of committing the else of committing the else of committing the crime. Hedgepet's roommate crime. Hedgepet's roommate who found the body, who found the body, Karina Rosario, was the Karina Rosario, was the Karina Rosario, was the subject of close subject of close subject of close scrutiny, with some believing scrutiny, with some believing scrutiny, with some believing she may have been she may have been she may have been involved because of her involved because of her involved because of her proximity to the victim proximity to the victim proximity to the victim and her behavior at the and her behavior at the and her behavior at the time of death. time of death. time of death. Prosecutors have decided Prosecutors have decided Prosecutors have decided to call Rosario to to call Rosario to to call Rosario to testify as their testify as their testify as their second witness on the second witness on the second witness on the first day of the first day of the first day of the trial, and her trial, and her trial, and her cross-examination by the cross-examination by the cross-examination by the defense is ongoing as defense is ongoing as defense is ongoing as we record this we record this we record this episode. Whether the questioning can episode. Whether the questioning can episode. Whether the questioning can raise any raise any raise any reasonable doubts reasonable doubts reasonable doubts among the jury remains to be among the jury remains to be among the jury remains to be seen, seen, seen, but we but we but we will continue to will continue to will continue to keep you updated keep you updated keep you updated . Um, Dave, first of all . Um, Dave, first of all , for those , for those , for those listening and watching, listening and watching, listening and watching, can you explain the can you explain the third-party liability here, third-party liability here, because the defense tried to because the defense tried to because the defense tried to squeeze some of these squeeze some of these squeeze some of these issues into their opening issues into their opening issues into their opening statements, and the judge statements, and the judge statements, and the judge shut it down pretty quickly, shut it down pretty quickly, shut it down pretty quickly, but it doesn't seem like they have but it doesn't seem like they have but it doesn't seem like they have much to go on much to go on . Why are they forbidden . Why are they forbidden . Why are they forbidden to express to express to express arguments?

arguments? arguments? Well, you can Well, you can Well, you can only make only make only make arguments that are arguments that are arguments that are based on based on based on some evidence. You some evidence. You some evidence. You can't go can't go can't go fishing. I fishing. I fishing. I mean, you have the mean, you have the mean, you have the right to a right to a right to a fair trial fair trial fair trial under the Sixth under the Sixth under the Sixth Amendment, but that doesn't Amendment, but that doesn't Amendment, but that doesn't mean you can mean you can mean you can say, you know, the say, you know, the say, you know, the real killer is real killer is Josh Ritter, and why is Josh Ritter, and why is Josh Ritter, and why is n't he in the n't he in the n't he in the courtroom? Here is an empty courtroom? Here is an empty courtroom? Here is an empty chair. It's like: chair. It's like: chair. It's like: wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You can't wait. You can't wait. You can't invent invent invent something out of thin air. That's something out of thin air. That's something out of thin air. That's why you remember the why you remember the why you remember the O.J. Simpson case O.J. Simpson case , where there was a big , where there was a big , where there was a big debate about whether debate about whether debate about whether Judge Ito would let the Judge Ito would let the Judge Ito would let the defense use defense use defense use the fact that Mark the fact that Mark the fact that Mark Furman was allegedly a Furman was allegedly a Furman was allegedly a racist, and, uh, they racist, and, uh, they racist, and, uh, they wanted to go down wanted to go down wanted to go down that rabbit hole, that rabbit hole, that rabbit hole, knowing that the jury knowing that the jury knowing that the jury would be pissed off about it. would be pissed off about it. would be pissed off about it. So, there are So, there are So, there are restrictions on... restrictions on... restrictions on... What was that? What was that? What was that? Colombian Colombian Colombian tie? Remember tie? Remember tie? Remember that part of the O.J. necklace? that part of the O.J. necklace? that part of the O.J. necklace? Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. What was that? What was that? What was that? Colombian? There is Colombian? There is Colombian? There is no evidence for this. So you no evidence for this. So you no evidence for this. So you can't just do that, can't just do that, can't just do that, because otherwise, like in a because otherwise, like in a because otherwise, like in a public debate, public debate, public debate, yeah, you can yeah, you can yeah, you can say, "Yeah, the Earth is say, "Yeah, the Earth is say, "Yeah, the Earth is flat, and John Wilkes flat, and John Wilkes flat, and John Wilkes Booth didn't kill Booth didn't kill Booth didn't kill Lincoln," and that...and you Lincoln," and that...and you Lincoln," and that...and you can say whatever you can say whatever you can say whatever you want. But in court you want. But in court you want. But in court you have to have some have to have some have to have some evidence evidence evidence based on based on based on evidence and law, and you evidence and law, and you evidence and law, and you don't want it to don't want it to don't want it to turn into a turn into a turn into a circus. And so the defense circus. And so the defense circus. And so the defense here here here leans heavily toward leans heavily toward leans heavily toward pointing to pointing to pointing to alternative alternative alternative timelines and the actions of people timelines and the actions of people timelines and the actions of people who were inside who were inside who were inside or associated with or associated with or associated with the apartment that night, the apartment that night, the apartment that night, particularly Faith's roommate particularly Faith's roommate particularly Faith's roommate , a woman , a woman , a woman named Carina Rosario.

named Carina Rosario. named Carina Rosario. Um, and there was a friend Um, and there was a friend Um, and there was a friend who took her. Um, who took her. Um, who took her. Um, yeah, you can yeah, you can yeah, you can see why they'd see why they'd do that. I do that. I mean, it doesn't mean, it doesn't mean, it doesn't matter. I matter. I matter. I mean, if you're there, at the mean, if you're there, at the mean, if you're there, at the scene, you scene, you scene, you can raise this can raise this can raise this issue. But the question issue. But the question issue. But the question is, is this a is, is this a is, is this a fishing fishing fishing expedition? Are you just expedition? Are you just expedition? Are you just going after people going after people going after people who have no connection to this who have no connection to this who have no connection to this to to to call someone a call someone a call someone a murderer? A judge won't murderer? A judge won't murderer? A judge won't let you just let you just let you just call some call some call some random person a random person a random person a murderer so you can get murderer so you can get murderer so you can get your your your client released. There client released. There client released. There must be some must be some must be some reason for this. And in the case reason for this. And in the case reason for this. And in the case of Rosario, there is some of Rosario, there is some of Rosario, there is some reason for this. I reason for this. I reason for this. I mean, I think they mean, I think they mean, I think they found the right found the right found the right person. They have, uh, person. They have, uh, person. They have, uh, scientific evidence, DNA. scientific evidence, DNA. scientific evidence, DNA. But, uh, you know, But, uh, you know, But, uh, you know, Rosario testified that Rosario testified that Rosario testified that she came back to she came back to she came back to the apartment sick, the apartment sick, the apartment sick, spent hours in the spent hours in the spent hours in the bathroom, and bathroom, and bathroom, and eventually a friend picked eventually a friend picked eventually a friend picked her up. So, uh, this is someone who her up. So, uh, this is someone who her up. So, uh, this is someone who was with Faith the night of the was with Faith the night of the was with Faith the night of the murder. Um, but she murder. Um, but she murder. Um, but she said she left the said she left the said she left the apartment door apartment door apartment door unlocked. And so, unlocked. And so, unlocked. And so, I mean, they I mean, they I mean, they say, “Okay, well, did say, “Okay, well, did say, “Okay, well, did you really leave? Did you you really leave? Did you you really leave? Did you really leave them really leave them really leave them unlocked? And are unlocked? And are unlocked? And are you the murderer? So, you the murderer? So, you the murderer? So, okay. okay. okay. Yeah, I don't think Yeah, I don't think Yeah, I don't think they're going to get they're going to get they're going to get much support for much support for much support for that, uh, theory from that, uh, theory from that, uh, theory from a jury, especially with a jury, especially with a jury, especially with all of his DNA all of his DNA all of his DNA found in very, uh, found in very, uh, found in very, uh, incriminating places, incriminating places, incriminating places, uh, at and around the scene uh, at and around the scene uh, at and around the scene , and , and , and on her body.

on her body. on her body. That's right. That's right. It's interesting that in this It's interesting that in this case she freezes case she freezes case she freezes for ten years. And for ten years. And for ten years. And then it breaks down then it breaks down then it breaks down because the alleged because the alleged because the alleged defendant, the defendant, the defendant, the alleged criminal, alleged criminal, alleged criminal, gets arrested for gets arrested for gets arrested for something innocuous, drunk something innocuous, drunk something innocuous, drunk driving driving , , and they do, uh, and they do, uh, and they do, uh, take a DNA swab from him take a DNA swab from him take a DNA swab from him . For some reason, . For some reason, . For some reason, because of this conviction, because of this conviction, because of this conviction, they demand a smear. they demand a smear. they demand a smear. Some jurisdictions Some jurisdictions Some jurisdictions are moving toward requiring are moving toward requiring people to people to take DNA swabs even in misdemeanor cases. And take DNA swabs even in misdemeanor cases. And take DNA swabs even in misdemeanor cases. And some see it some see it some see it as perhaps as perhaps as perhaps overstepping the bounds of, uh, overstepping the bounds of, uh, overstepping the bounds of, uh, intrusion into intrusion into intrusion into privacy. But look privacy. But look privacy. But look at this. We are currently at this. We are currently at this. We are currently investigating a case investigating a case investigating a case that is 14 years old, and it seems like that is 14 years old, and it seems like that is 14 years old, and it seems like they don't have any they don't have any they don't have any hot leads. What do hot leads. What do hot leads. What do you think about this you think about this you think about this ? Should we ? Should we ? Should we collect more DNA, collect more DNA, collect more DNA, or is this a problem? or is this a problem? or is this a problem? Well, there has to be some Well, there has to be some privacy protection. I privacy protection. I mean, I don't mean, I don't mean, I don't want a want a want a police officer to stop police officer to stop police officer to stop me on the side of me on the side of me on the side of the road because I was the road because I was speeding and then speeding and then take a swab of my cheek. take a swab of my cheek. take a swab of my cheek. Open your mouth. Open your mouth. Open your mouth. Right? Now Right? Now Right? Now remind me, did remind me, did remind me, did he, uh, consent to this he, uh, consent to this he, uh, consent to this ? I would think ? I would think ? I would think he would, right? He was he would, right? He was he would, right? He was arrested, but did arrested, but did arrested, but did he consent to the he consent to the he consent to the swab?

swab? swab? I know, I don't know the I know, I don't know the I know, I don't know the actual circumstances of actual circumstances of actual circumstances of this, but I think this, but I think this, but I think probably not. I...maybe probably not. I...maybe ...We don't know. But I ...We don't know. But I ...We don't know. But I always always always assume that assume that assume that maybe this was one maybe this was one maybe this was one of those situations where, of those situations where, of those situations where, uh, you know, to uh, you know, to uh, you know, to avoid jail avoid jail avoid jail time, we time, we time, we need a DNA sample need a DNA sample need a DNA sample even for a misdemeanor. even for a misdemeanor. even for a misdemeanor. You know, if it weren't for stupid You know, if it weren't for stupid You know, if it weren't for stupid criminals, it would be much harder for us criminals, it would be much harder for us criminals, it would be much harder for us prosecutors, would prosecutors, would n't it? I mean, n't it? I mean, how many times have we how many times have we how many times have we seen a seen a seen a defendant simply defendant simply defendant simply consent? They... consent? They... the police are like, " the police are like, " Hey, do you Hey, do you Hey, do you mind if I mind if I mind if I search your car?" search your car?" search your car?" "Oh no, give it." Oh, "Oh no, give it." Oh, "Oh no, give it." Oh, okay. Now, um, okay. Now, um, okay. Now, um, obviously, I don't think obviously, I don't think obviously, I don't think he gave consent he gave consent he gave consent because, um, it was because, um, it was because, um, it was standard standard standard booking procedure, um, in the booking procedure, um, in the booking procedure, um, in the department. So, I guess department. So, I guess department. So, I guess they take a swab from you they take a swab from you they take a swab from you if it's if it's drunk driving. Yes. Yes. Yes, yes, because if you Yes, yes, because if you Yes, yes, because if you are put in prison are put in prison are put in prison on certain on certain on certain criminal criminal criminal charges, they charges, they charges, they take a swab from you there. And I take a swab from you there. And I take a swab from you there. And I think it's like taking a think it's like taking a think it's like taking a fingerprint or fingerprint or fingerprint or a photo from an a photo from an a photo from an ID card.

ID card. ID card. So in some So in some So in some jurisdictions they jurisdictions they jurisdictions they add a add a add a DNA sample to it. So it's not DNA sample to it. So it's not DNA sample to it. So it's not just a question of, " just a question of, " just a question of, " Can we take a swab Can we take a swab Can we take a swab of your cheek?" This is of your cheek?" This is of your cheek?" This is actually an actually an actually an administrative administrative administrative requirement. Uh, and it requirement. Uh, and it requirement. Uh, and it got into the system, got into the system, got into the system, and it exposed the whole and it exposed the whole and it exposed the whole thing. So, in that thing. So, in that thing. So, in that case, yes, I case, yes, I case, yes, I like that they like that they like that they did it. I think did it. I think did it. I think if you get arrested if you get arrested if you get arrested for a crime, I for a crime, I for a crime, I actually think actually think actually think it's not a bad idea. You it's not a bad idea. You it's not a bad idea. You take a swab, you take a swab, you take a swab, you can see that can see that can see that this person is connected, this person is connected, this person is connected, has open has open has open arrest warrants, um, you know, arrest warrants, um, you know, arrest warrants, um, you know, made-up names, made-up names, made-up names, you know, you...There are a you know, you...There are a you know, you...There are a lot of possibilities here. lot of possibilities here. lot of possibilities here. Yes. Yes. I know this is a Yes. Yes. I know this is a Yes. Yes. I know this is a pretty heated pretty heated pretty heated conversation because conversation because conversation because some people some people some people feel like, "Hey, like feel like, "Hey, like feel like, "Hey, like you said, I you said, I you said, I shouldn't just shouldn't just shouldn't just be stopped and all of a sudden be stopped and all of a sudden be stopped and all of a sudden I'm being searched like a I'm being searched like a I'm being searched like a DNA swab." But they are DNA swab." But they are DNA swab." But they are so so so different from different from fingerprinting. They fingerprinting. They check your check your check your fingerprints, by fingerprints, by fingerprints, by the way. the way. the way. That's right. No, that's all. That's right. No, that's all. That's right. No, that's all. This is a consequence of this. This is what This is a consequence of this. This is what This is a consequence of this. This is what we...We do we...We do we...We do fingerprints, fingerprints, fingerprints, why not DNA? This is a why not DNA? This is a why not DNA? This is a modern modern modern fingerprint, right? It is fingerprint, right? It is fingerprint, right? It is better and more accurate. And better and more accurate. And better and more accurate. And that way they that way they that way they can also can also can also make sure they make sure they make sure they have the right have the right have the right person. I mean person. I mean , I have a client , I have a client , I have a client who was arrested who was arrested who was arrested even though he wasn't the even though he wasn't the even though he wasn't the person they were person they were person they were looking for. They thought looking for. They thought looking for. They thought he was like that, and they he was like that, and they he was like that, and they had to finally had to finally had to finally prove it: "No, I'm not prove it: "No, I'm not prove it: "No, I'm not that guy." It that guy." It that guy." It matched the description, or matched the description, or perhaps partially.

perhaps partially. perhaps partially. So if there was a So if there was a So if there was a DNA swab right away, they could DNA swab right away, they could DNA swab right away, they could say, “Oh, no. say, “Oh, no. say, “Oh, no. Go. You can go." Go. You can go." Go. You can go." So, there So, there So, there are some positives for the public are some positives for the public . . Yes. Well, this Yes. Well, this Yes. Well, this lawsuit is ongoing. We lawsuit is ongoing. We lawsuit is ongoing. We will continue to monitor will continue to monitor will continue to monitor him. Let's him. Let's him. Let's quickly move on to quickly move on to quickly move on to our latest our latest our latest case here in case here in case here in Jacksonville, Jacksonville, Jacksonville, Florida. And I'm glad Florida. And I'm glad Florida. And I'm glad we have a man from Florida here to we have a man from Florida here to help us get help us get through this. The alleged through this. The alleged through this. The alleged shooter shooter shooter accused of accused of accused of killing a killing a killing a Microsoft executive has appeared in Microsoft executive has appeared in Microsoft executive has appeared in court on several court on several court on several lesser lesser lesser charges charges charges after a prosecutor after a prosecutor after a prosecutor dismissed previous dismissed previous indictments. Harry Tenon , who pleaded , who pleaded , who pleaded guilty to the guilty to the guilty to the charges, will no longer be charges, will no longer be charges, will no longer be charged with charged with child abuse, child abuse, conspiracy to commit conspiracy to commit conspiracy to commit murder or aiding and murder or aiding and murder or aiding and abetting after the abetting after the abetting after the fact. fact. fact. Tenon is accused Tenon is accused Tenon is accused of of of pulling the trigger on pulling the trigger on pulling the trigger on Jared Bridgehan at Jared Bridgehan at Jared Bridgehan at the behest of the behest of the behest of Bridgehan's ex-wife, Bridgehan's ex-wife, Bridgehan's ex-wife, Shanna Gardner, and her Shanna Gardner, and her Shanna Gardner, and her husband, Mario husband, Mario husband, Mario Fernandez, with whom Fernandez, with whom Fernandez, with whom he lived separately, he lived separately, he lived separately, if you can if you can if you can make sense of all that. make sense of all that. make sense of all that. Bridgen was Bridgen was Bridgen was fatally wounded fatally wounded fatally wounded in a custody dispute in a custody dispute in a custody dispute after taking away after taking away after taking away the twins he the twins he the twins he had with Gardner had with Gardner . Although the victim's two-year-old . Although the victim's two-year-old . Although the victim's two-year-old daughter, daughter, daughter, heartbreakingly, was heartbreakingly, was heartbreakingly, was in the car at the time of in the car at the time of in the car at the time of the murder, prosecutors the murder, prosecutors the murder, prosecutors dropped dropped child abuse charges child abuse charges against Tenon against Tenon against Tenon and Gardner, as well as and Gardner, as well as Gardner's charge of solicitation Gardner's charge of solicitation to commit a to commit a to commit a felony. Although the felony. Although the felony. Although the alleged shooters alleged shooters alleged shooters and conspirators and conspirators and conspirators face fewer face fewer face fewer charges, charges, Fernandez's conviction could be a Fernandez's conviction could be a bad sign bad sign bad sign ahead of a ahead of a ahead of a combined, joint combined, joint combined, joint trial trial trial for Tenon and Gardner for Tenon and Gardner . Okay, there are a lot of . Okay, there are a lot of . Okay, there are a lot of moving parts here, but moving parts here, but moving parts here, but one thing I'm one thing I'm one thing I'm interested in, not so much the interested in, not so much the interested in, not so much the dismissal of the dismissal of the child abuse charge, child abuse charge, it makes sense. That was it makes sense. That was it makes sense. That was a bit of a stretch. But a bit of a stretch. But a bit of a stretch. But why the removal of conspiracy to why the removal of conspiracy to why the removal of conspiracy to murder? What will you murder? What will you murder? What will you do? Is this just an

do? Is this just an do? Is this just an idea to simplify idea to simplify idea to simplify things, or do you think there's things, or do you think there's things, or do you think there's something else going on? something else going on? something else going on? Well, first of all, I'm glad Well, first of all, I'm glad Well, first of all, I'm glad they caught they caught they caught this guy. this guy. this guy. It was always an It was always an It was always an obvious thing for me. I obvious thing for me. I obvious thing for me. I mean, they... mean, they... they had it. They...It they had it. They...It they had it. They...It was so disgusting. They was so disgusting. They was so disgusting. They put the tire on the put the tire on the put the tire on the road, right? A guy road, right? A guy road, right? A guy comes out, he comes out, he comes out, he is killed in front of is killed in front of is killed in front of his daughter. Yes. So his daughter. Yes. So his daughter. Yes. So it was disgusting, and I it was disgusting, and I it was disgusting, and I think they...Didn't the think they...Didn't the think they...Didn't the defendants, the ones who defendants, the ones who defendants, the ones who stayed, hire stayed, hire stayed, hire Jose Jose Jose Baez, uh, the two Baez, uh, the two Baez, uh, the two best? best? best? Baez represents Baez represents Baez represents Gardner. Yes. Gardner. Yes. Gardner. Yes. Yes, I remember, it's the same one Yes, I remember, it's the same one Yes, I remember, it's the same one . He's a very, uh, . He's a very, uh, . He's a very, uh, respected criminal lawyer respected criminal lawyer who brought out, uh, Casey who brought out, uh, Casey Anthony. And Casey Anthony. And Casey Anthony. And Casey Anthony, um, I Anthony, um, I Anthony, um, I think he's a brutal think he's a brutal think he's a brutal child murderer, but child murderer, but child murderer, but okay. I think so okay. I think so okay. I think so . . . Another episode. Another episode. Another episode. Yes, another episode for Yes, another episode for Yes, another episode for another day. Good. another day. Good. another day. Good. So, excluding the So, excluding the So, excluding the conspiracy charge conspiracy charge conspiracy charge and the and the child abuse version, hmm, they child abuse version, hmm, they did that did that did that right before right before Fernandez's trial, Fernandez's trial, right? I think this is an right? I think this is an optimization strategy. This is not a optimization strategy. This is not a sign that it is a sign that it is a sign that it is a weakness. And I think weakness. And I think weakness. And I think that to prove that to prove that to prove conspiracy, you need to conspiracy, you need to conspiracy, you need to establish a formal establish a formal establish a formal agreement between multiple agreement between multiple agreement between multiple parties to parties to parties to commit a crime. And commit a crime. And commit a crime. And the prosecutors obviously, the prosecutors obviously, the prosecutors obviously, um, believed that there was um, believed that there was um, believed that there was collusion, um, but collusion, um, but collusion, um, but if it was separate, the if it was separate, the if it was separate, the defense attorneys defense attorneys defense attorneys could have anticipated the could have anticipated the could have anticipated the hyper-tech hyper-tech hyper-tech legal elements legal elements legal elements during during during jury instructions, I think. I jury instructions, I think. I jury instructions, I think. I think this think this think this optimizes the form of optimizes the form of optimizes the form of jury work.

jury work. You know, prosecutors You know, prosecutors often drop often drop often drop these additional these additional these additional charges and charges and charges and focus on focus on focus on first- first- first- degree murder and degree murder and degree murder and incitement to incitement to incitement to commit a commit a commit a felony punishable by felony punishable by felony punishable by death. And this, I think, death. And this, I think, death. And this, I think, simplifies the path to a simplifies the path to a simplifies the path to a guilty guilty guilty verdict. This is a strategy. verdict. This is a strategy. verdict. This is a strategy. If you prove If you prove If you prove incitement and that incitement and that incitement and that he organized he organized he organized the murder for hire, the murder for hire, the murder for hire, then the main objectives then the main objectives then the main objectives of the prosecution will be of the prosecution will be of the prosecution will be achieved without achieved without achieved without having to having to having to muddy the waters. muddy the waters. muddy the waters. Yes. Last Yes. Last Yes. Last question on this question on this question on this , and I know , and I know , and I know we only have a we only have a we only have a few minutes left, so I'll few minutes left, so I'll few minutes left, so I'll try to keep it try to keep it try to keep it as simple as possible. But as simple as possible. But as simple as possible. But here on the horizon here on the horizon here on the horizon is the is the is the rumor problem when you have rumor problem when you have rumor problem when you have Gardner and Tennant on Gardner and Tennant on Gardner and Tennant on trial together because trial together because trial together because Tennant was originally Tennant was originally Tennant was originally going to testify going to testify going to testify against everyone. Tennant against everyone. Tennant against everyone. Tennant obviously knows some obviously knows some obviously knows some things and things and things and has probably made some statements has probably made some statements has probably made some statements that, well, you know, that, well, you know, that, well, you know, expose him. But expose him. But expose him. But these statements can't these statements can't these statements can't be used be used be used against Gardner against Gardner against Gardner because we have these problems because we have these problems because we have these problems with rumors. So how do with rumors. So how do with rumors. So how do you think this all you think this all you think this all plays out? And will plays out? And will the prosecution have to the prosecution have to avoid even avoid even avoid even asking some of these asking some of these asking some of these more provocative more provocative more provocative questions against questions against questions against Tennant because Tennant because Tennant because they're both on trial they're both on trial they're both on trial together, if you can together, if you can together, if you can understand.

understand. Yes, it's complicated Yes, it's complicated because the Supreme Court has had because the Supreme Court has had because the Supreme Court has had some precedent here some precedent here some precedent here under the Sixth under the Sixth under the Sixth Amendment that it Amendment that it Amendment that it violates a violates a violates a defendant's right to defendant's right to defendant's right to confrontation with confrontation with confrontation with his accuser his accuser his accuser if a co-defendant's out-of-court if a co-defendant's out-of-court if a co-defendant's out-of-court testimony testimony is used at a is used at a joint joint joint trial. trial. trial. Right. Right. Right. Especially if this Especially if this Especially if this co-defendant does not co-defendant does not co-defendant does not testify or submit to testify or submit to testify or submit to cross- cross- cross- examination. You can examination. You can examination. You can see the problem. Whereas how can see the problem. Whereas how can see the problem. Whereas how can I confront I confront I confront a person against you, because a person against you, because a person against you, because a confession, a statement by a a confession, a statement by a a confession, a statement by a co-defendant, is co-defendant, is co-defendant, is admissible, because it is not a admissible, because it is not a admissible, because it is not a rumor, it is a statement by rumor, it is a statement by rumor, it is a statement by an opponent. But is an opponent. But is an opponent. But is this permissible against a this permissible against a this permissible against a co-defendant who co-defendant who co-defendant who cannot then cannot then cannot then be be be cross-examined? cross-examined? cross-examined? Cross-examination, Cross-examination, Cross-examination, yes. yes. yes. Yes. This is a violation of the Yes. This is a violation of the Yes. This is a violation of the Sixth Amendment, right? Sixth Amendment, right? Sixth Amendment, right? This is permissible against This is permissible against This is permissible against the defendant, but a the defendant, but a the defendant, but a co-defendant is co-defendant is co-defendant is another matter. So what's another matter. So what's another matter. So what's also sad is that also sad is that you have this you have this you have this guy, Tennen, who guy, Tennen, who guy, Tennen, who initially agreed initially agreed initially agreed to a to a to a plea deal. Remember, he plea deal. Remember, he plea deal. Remember, he agreed. He said, agreed. He said, "Okay, I plead "Okay, I plead "Okay, I plead guilty. They told guilty. They told guilty. They told me to do it." And me to do it." And me to do it." And then he went back on then he went back on then he went back on his words. his words. his words. He later violated He later violated He later violated that agreement, withdrew that agreement, withdrew that agreement, withdrew his his his guilty plea, and is now guilty plea, and is now guilty plea, and is now headed to trial with headed to trial with headed to trial with Garner.

Garner. Garner. I hope they are all I hope they are all I hope they are all found guilty. found guilty. found guilty. This whole thing disgusts me This whole thing disgusts me . . . I completely agree with you I completely agree with you I completely agree with you . And I . And I . And I hope it hope it hope it happens sooner rather than happens sooner rather than happens sooner rather than later, because this has been later, because this has been later, because this has been going on for years. going on for years. going on for years. Dave, thank you so much for Dave, thank you so much for Dave, thank you so much for stopping by this week. stopping by this week. stopping by this week. Where can people Where can people Where can people learn more about you learn more about you learn more about you ? ? ? Of course, you can Of course, you can Of course, you can find me on my find me on my find me on my YouTube channel. This is Dave YouTube channel. This is Dave YouTube channel. This is Dave Aronberg. I also Aronberg. I also Aronberg. I also call myself Florida Law Man call myself Florida Law Man . You can search in . You can search in . You can search in any direction. any direction. any direction. I'm also on Substack. So I'm also on Substack. So I'm also on Substack. So find me there. find me there. find me there. I also have a show on I also have a show on I also have a show on MK True Crime. I MK True Crime. I MK True Crime. I co-host a co-host a co-host a true crime show there. true crime show there. true crime show there. So I'm busy. But, So I'm busy. But, So I'm busy. But, you know, Josh, we you know, Josh, we you know, Josh, we always have great always have great always have great conversations with you, so conversations with you, so conversations with you, so let's let's let's do it again sometime. do it again sometime. do it again sometime. I like it. I like it. I like it. Thank you very much, friend. I'm Thank you very much, friend. I'm Thank you very much, friend. I'm your host, Joshua your host, Joshua your host, Joshua Ritter. You can Ritter. You can Ritter. You can find me on Instagram and find me on Instagram and find me on Instagram and Twitter at Joshua Twitter at Joshua Twitter at Joshua Ritter, Esq. And if you Ritter, Esq. And if you Ritter, Esq. And if you want to hear my want to hear my want to hear my thoughts and coverage thoughts and coverage of even more true of even more true crime cases, please crime cases, please crime cases, please check out my check out my check out my YouTube channel Courtroom YouTube channel Courtroom YouTube channel Courtroom Confidential. And you Confidential. And you can, of course, find all can, of course, find all can, of course, find all our episodes in the our episodes in the our episodes in the sidebar wherever you sidebar wherever you sidebar wherever you listen to your listen to your listen to your podcast. We would podcast. We would podcast. We would love to hear from you love to hear from you love to hear from you if you have any if you have any if you have any questions or questions or questions or comments you comments you comments you would like us to would like us to would like us to answer. Please answer. Please tweet us tweet us tweet us your questions with the your questions with the your questions with the hashtag TC N Sidebar. And hashtag TC N Sidebar. And hashtag TC N Sidebar. And thanks for thanks for thanks for joining us on the joining us on the joining us on the True Crime True Crime True Crime News sidebar.